Skimpy outfits - it's ok to like them, and it's ok for me NOT to like them
My daughter wanted to buy Batman: Arkham Knight on PS4 to play so I was playing (well, I was sitting down with my kids watching Aimei playing Arkham knight) and he was up to a bit where Poison Ivy was being taken into custody. I looked at her outfit and couldn't help rolling my eyes.
What on earth is she wearing - or rather, not wearing? What a dreadful outfit. There is no reason why she should be dressed like that.
No, this is not another one of those "treat women with respect in games" posts, though in a way it is, because my daughter wanted to play this game, and this isn't particularly what I want her to be thinking is normal, or practical for heroes or villains. Batman isn't wandering around shirtless. Admittedly, Catwoman doesn't either. I guess because they both are fighting.
What was amusing was that I didn't even have to say anything to my daughter about Ivy's outfit. She said to me "I can see her belly button, mum." I said to her "Do you like what she's wearing?"
"No," she replied. "She should wear a shirt."
I wish she had also said she should be wearing pants, but it was one of those half body shots that she was watching at the time so she may not have noticed she was wandering around in a bikini bottom.
It reminded me of something Chris Metzen said at Blizzcon, when his daughters were watching the final scene in Dragon Soul where the aspects come up to Thrall and Agra. They said to him "Dad, why are they in bikinis?" His answer, was an abashed "Umm, I don't know."
And then they were talking about Overwatch and I thought I think they've made some headway here, we actually have a whole range of girls to choose from from fully armoured to fully skimpy. So everyone gets to pick what they like! Who wouldn't pick Tracer?? :D
Interestingly, right after I stopped watching Arkham Knight and went to go play WoW (and do some PvP with Sev, Shab and Scruff), I decided to buy my Conquest chest to replace the Wild one I got from my Ashran weekly cache. Those wild ones don't give you set bonuses and I had two Wild items and thus had broken my 4 set bonus.
Anyway, I put it on and I was wearing THIS:
I know some people will think it looks great, especially on a night elf, but you know I'm not a fan of this kind of outfit!!!
So I hunted around for a shirt to wear underneath and this looks decent now.
So this post is just to say that I'm glad my daughter is on the right track. Now, to make sure my son is on the right track too. I'll tell him how silly it is to have girls parading around in their underwear when they're supposed to be fighting - it's ok for the beach or the catwalk though! Which is why mummy's character is fully clothed when she is playing so she doesn't get hurt so much /grin
What on earth is she wearing - or rather, not wearing? What a dreadful outfit. There is no reason why she should be dressed like that.
No, this is not another one of those "treat women with respect in games" posts, though in a way it is, because my daughter wanted to play this game, and this isn't particularly what I want her to be thinking is normal, or practical for heroes or villains. Batman isn't wandering around shirtless. Admittedly, Catwoman doesn't either. I guess because they both are fighting.
What was amusing was that I didn't even have to say anything to my daughter about Ivy's outfit. She said to me "I can see her belly button, mum." I said to her "Do you like what she's wearing?"
"No," she replied. "She should wear a shirt."
I wish she had also said she should be wearing pants, but it was one of those half body shots that she was watching at the time so she may not have noticed she was wandering around in a bikini bottom.
It reminded me of something Chris Metzen said at Blizzcon, when his daughters were watching the final scene in Dragon Soul where the aspects come up to Thrall and Agra. They said to him "Dad, why are they in bikinis?" His answer, was an abashed "Umm, I don't know."
And then they were talking about Overwatch and I thought I think they've made some headway here, we actually have a whole range of girls to choose from from fully armoured to fully skimpy. So everyone gets to pick what they like! Who wouldn't pick Tracer?? :D
Interestingly, right after I stopped watching Arkham Knight and went to go play WoW (and do some PvP with Sev, Shab and Scruff), I decided to buy my Conquest chest to replace the Wild one I got from my Ashran weekly cache. Those wild ones don't give you set bonuses and I had two Wild items and thus had broken my 4 set bonus.
Anyway, I put it on and I was wearing THIS:
I know some people will think it looks great, especially on a night elf, but you know I'm not a fan of this kind of outfit!!!
So I hunted around for a shirt to wear underneath and this looks decent now.
So this post is just to say that I'm glad my daughter is on the right track. Now, to make sure my son is on the right track too. I'll tell him how silly it is to have girls parading around in their underwear when they're supposed to be fighting - it's ok for the beach or the catwalk though! Which is why mummy's character is fully clothed when she is playing so she doesn't get hurt so much /grin
I love the way you asked your daughter a question that let her think about and give her own opinion on the subject. If and when I ever have kids, I'll have to remember to do that.
ReplyDeleteIndeed, that robe looks much better with the shirt! Is that one of the Brawler's Guild shirts?
Yes! It's It's Ooze soaked shirt from Brawlers. And daughters are fun like that :)
DeleteI'm not opposed to sexy armor. I know some people like that sort of thing, and that's fine. I just think there should be more choice. My current favorite game is Skyrim. And I have to say, the armor in that is by far some of the most modest across both genders (with a few exceptions of course, but they're in cases that MAKE SENSE... relatively. Like Barbarian fur armor and such). I don't think I realized just how inured I had become to WoW's (and many other games') sense of "sexy lady armor" until I started playing Skyrim and really paying attention to what everyone was wearing. Of course, there's games that go the polar opposite, like Final Fantasy XIV where if an outfit is skimpy on a female, you can be pretty damn sure it'll be just as ridiculously skimpy on a male. So there's that sort of equality too.
ReplyDeleteAnyway, i love everything said in this post.
Thanks Achloryn. I am not saying I think all bikinis are bad, I just don't want to wear them. Heaps of people like them! Just not me.
Delete"I'll tell him how silly it is to have girls parading around in their underwear when they're supposed to be fighting"
ReplyDeleteWell, see, the goal of the tank is to distract the boss and get the boss to focus on her, right?...
I'll just start fleeing for my life now.
LOL well, I am not a tank. I'm a healer, so there is no way I want boss agro! /rasp
DeleteI dunno, I mean, we had our Holy Paladin tank the Tidewalker murlocs in Serpentshrine Cavern. Maybe Righteous Fury had something to do with it, but obviously we wanted to optimize and get every advantage we could, right? Why risk it?
DeleteI ran into this character today in a PUG...agility based class, so need maximum mobility, right?
http://us.battle.net/wow/en/character/Anvilmar/M%C3%ACnx/advanced
Hey that's the bikini I was wearing!! Though interestingly I only have that look with the tier piece but not the Wild piece.
DeleteAnd I'm just putting this here (not because it's related to your comment in anyway, but just so i can go back to it to reread it https://gameswithfriendswrites.wordpress.com/2015/07/07/batman-arkham-knights-big-problem-female-representation
When I talk to my daughter about it, my party line is also "That's stupid, armor needs to protect your *organs*". It's kind of the most important part of the whole armor thing.
ReplyDeleteI just found out my tier set looks like this too (so it looks like I need to find more shirts). I agree about the armour thing. If it was for a party then I think it's ok.
DeleteYes, it isn't about the skimpy outfits themselves, it is about whether or not you have the choice to wear those skimpy outfits or not. If you have no choice (because all/most or few/none of them are skimpy) then that is bad. Similarly, it is only bad on NPCs if it is the "default", overwhelming majority that are dressed that way. To some extent realism factors in - I've never understood platekini, if you wear plate then you want protection everywhere, not like 20% of your body - but I think even that can play second string to range of choice and presentation.
ReplyDeleteIt is respecting people's choice which is the crux of this matter, and if they want to wear platekini they then should, right? I'm glad there is choice, and I am glad there is a shirt that goes with my outfit.
Delete